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LukOhms

Group Pages

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I'd imagine its already planned to be implemented when the sever kicks off but is there going to be a group page similar to the character one? Where people can display group pictures, lore, allies, enemies and other information? Also, when groups appear will they receive private rooms in the TeamSpeak/ Discord? Perhaps after they have five members? or with some other limiter so not everyone has their own private lounge as that could get out of hand.

Edited by LukOhms

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Groups are actually going to be handled differently in this community than most you've probably played on before. We are aiming to have groups handled almost entirely within the game, meaning there will likely be no group pages or anything of the sort on the forums. We're still working on what thats going to actually look like, and there may still be some sort of metric by which we recognize "official groups", but right now the plan is to avoid handling that sort of stuff on the forums.


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41 minutes ago, Jasper said:

 there's a place for new comers to see what kind of groups are in game. 

That is the issue with group threads right there. We do not want people to meta-game the experience you have while playing. If there is a mafia taxing people for protection against ISF corruption, or a group of evil doctors performing experiments on people, that should be a random encounter experience. Reading about this mysterious group on the forums will completely remove the mystic of said groups. 

Also, group threads provide nothing but OOC drama and salt. People constantly posting back handed comments on each others threads which leads to constant attacks in and out of game.

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4 minutes ago, Jasper said:

 snip

I think group activity and presence could be communicated through a media thread just as much an official group thread.


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I think if a group wants to make a thread they do a media thread if anything. People can look or not at what they do. An usually they have fun videos and so on. To entice the new people.

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Groups in general will probably be alot different than others servers since there is alot of draw backs to being public with them. If you were to form a resistance group with a well defined theme and appearance then the ISF will simply root you out and push the group out of the city or see its members dealt with in any number of ways.  Sure a group might be fairly neutral in its attitude towards the NCC, but that does not mean the NCC has to think of them as benign. Really any sort of organization could be seen as a future threat to stability and there could be a desire to deal with it preemptively.

Most likely people will find more success in being an individual as opposed to be part of a defined group, as individuals can still band together and help one another without having a very visible target on their back.

This also ties into metagaming, because the ISF will probably have a number of informants and it will always be hard to tell where that information really came from. Its probably better off to play it safe and make sure as little information gets out there about your group.

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Personally, I'm with Jasper in that I like and want group pages - for me, I like writing the page that other people see. Idk. Probably my own vanity. 

So while I'd like to see them, CUDA has a point by saying it could just as easily be added as a media thread.

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I'm leaning more towards leaving things in-character. On previous communities, group pages were more so to vent KOS rights and so on (and we know that's not gonna be a thing here) and resulted in people creating OOC opinions about a certain group before even really interacting with them. 

A media thread might even be too much in some cases and can easily devolve roleplay into what we've experienced before, with certain groups gaining an OOC reputation for either being too focused in either PVP or whatever else - but really who can say how someone uses their media thread.

Edited by Xavier

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3 hours ago, Xavier said:

...and resulted in people creating OOC opinions about a certain group before even really interacting with them. 

This hits the nail on the head. I know a lot of people (including me) love making groups threads and writing the lore, but the result is ultimately people learning about these things OOC and not IC. It's almost impossible not to metagame information of this nature even if you don't intend to, and you end up with a server devoid of mystery or surprises. Everything becomes predictable - the only thing that breaks the monotony is new groups which then causes the cycle to repeat.

The issue would be especially prominent with the NCC and "rebel" factions; if I read on the forums that you're a part of a group and I'm interrogating you IC about it, I know if you're lying. Even if I had a hunch or decent evidence IC, you could accuse me of metagaming and you'd technically be correct. Alternatively, if I'm intentionally metagaming the information but asspull an excuse like "I recognised your face/clothing/voice", there's no way you can know if I'm being truthful or not.

We are in a really good position to at least "experiment" with the status quo. If it doesn't work out, that's cool, we could have public group forums implemented within maybe 48 hours. However, there are plenty of other great RP experiences (outside of DayZ) that do things differently and succeed in doing so. I think we should at least try to change the standard before reverting to it.

11 hours ago, Jasper said:

Like group's should be formed in game right, then once they prove themselves to be influential or at least recognized in game, they can apply to staff or whoever handles that (Probably lore team) if they can be put on the official group page. That way both sides of the argument are happy and there's a place for new comers to see what kind of groups are in game.

This is more or less what I'm advocating for, personally. If a group deserves recognition or requires private forums I'm fine with giving them that, but the bar has to be high.

10 hours ago, Jasper said:

Yes but also whitenames have room temperature IQ and will look at the lack of group threads and say "ha ha dead server" and leave the page probably. Also when you're new to the community or roleplay in general, it's nice to have forums to look at and get a gist of what's going on.

I think that, more often than not, new players just look how full/empty the server is. If we manage to get a decent playerbase, my hope is that newcomers will stick around and play more after figuring out the depth to the server requires IC commitment and actual RP.

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I can see why people enjoy writing group lore, and creating a group page. (Looks alone can be fun to create and rep) But having things be a mystery is more enticing. It leaves the player to wonder who they're going to run into and what there intentions are going to be when they finally meet them. Now like it's been said above I believe. It'll be harder for staff to conduct reports and what not, but I'm sure they can get a system going. (Private google docs, PM's, ect.) I think we should give people the option. If you want to rep your group on the forums and risk meta-game, then so be it. It's your choice to possibly get your group names leaked and have people question your actions IG for an OOC reason. Or people can choose to fly under the radar and give only staff access to names, goals, ect. This is just my thoughts on it. I hate flying under the radar only to get outed because I was on the wrong roster. 

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I agree with no group pages


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Also part of the fun is coming in and being completely lost. People will struggle to fit in when they arrive to the bastion both IC and OOC and will organically be able to choose whether to work with or against the ISF. They mystery of the bastion when you join will be something really fun I feel.

 

In other communities I've seen the tendency to create characters which are aimed at joining a group a person found OOC. The beauty I feel is that groups will form more naturally with very diverse personalities as people will create a character first and see where the journey takes them.

Edited by K-Jack

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